Manifesting Our Visions with Ancient Practices, Endogenous Tools & Modern Technology

What are endogenous and exogenous technologies, and how can this framework help us bring our ideas to life? Join Modern Mantra founders Nick and Elijah as they catch up on the concepts that have been circulating for them recently.

Elijah starts by sharing around his recent explorations with music and plant medicine. Find out how making music has deepened his connection with nature, and expanded his understanding of endogenous tools: our inbuilt technologies, such as the breath and the voice.

Turning to the ‘exogenous’ - our external, tangible technologies - what happens as we start visualizing the invisible? Nick discusses the tech that could change the landscape for healers, and envisions what becomes possible when our inner dimensions begin to synthesise with the digital scape.

Tune in to get inspired by ancient wisdom, fresh ideas and new innovation for accessing your core essence, and unlocking the creative magic to start manifesting your visions into reality.

Show notes:

• 04:52 Tapping into Icaros, the frequencies of nature
• 14:07 Endogenous and exogenous technologies
• 20:16 The body as an interface: ancient practices for recentering
• 25:46 Music making for intimacy with nature, self and others
• 33:24 Digitally visualising the human energy field
• 44:33 When modern science catches up with ancient wisdom

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Elijah: we can work with the breath as a controller, right? if I'm sitting here on the computer and my keyboard is a controller, Within my body, my breath is a controller.

I can use my breath to entirely control my state of consciousness and my state of mind. I can use my breath to access information. I can use my breath to open up my voice.

And so the essence of it is really 

 how we attune ourselves using our own medicine, our own endogenous technology, and how we use that attuned, expanded, awakened state to create and manifest using exogenous technologies. 

[00:00:41] Nick: [00:01:00] [00:02:00] Hey brother. 

Man, what a ride. It's been for the last couple weeks for both of us. So you're coming off of a several month adventure into the jungles of Costa Rica and integrating this beautiful medicine, beautiful music, these beautiful practices into what you're doing. I would love to, get, little insight as to where you've been, what you've been up to, and what you've been [00:03:00] doing.

[00:03:01] Elijah: Yeah, so I've been down here in the Diamante Valley in Costa Rica for the last, almost five months now. We've been here since the beginning of the year. we actually live here and have some land here, and we live between this community in the Valley and Asheville. And so for the past two months specifically, we have been partaking in an apprenticeship.

Program. It's the Sound of Light apprenticeship program, and it's led by the two co-founders of this community, vis mine, Nicole, who I would consider to be incredible pioneers when it comes to unifying different lineages, different traditions, different sectors of ancestral wisdom when it comes to the weaving between music and plant medicine.

and when it comes to sacred space holding and what that looks like, and so I've been down here doing an apprenticeship under them, [00:04:00] learning the ways of. The medicine learning, really learning the medicine path from them. And that comes through in understanding a lot of contextual knowledge about the different lineages of the medicine, understanding about the medicine itself and the plants, understanding how to work with the spirits of nature.

And a huge part of the program has been music. And diving deep into, what music is, what sound is and how to turn sound into music, how to produce sacred sound, how to use music to facilitate healing experiences. So that's where I've been for the last five months. But the apprenticeships been two months.

[00:04:52] Nick: one thing that. I find the most fascinating about where you are and what you're doing is the relationship between the [00:05:00] medicine and the music and how everybody's going through the program is not only introduced to the path of integrating medicine and the apprenticeship, but also the music explicitly.

What have you discovered about the nature of the relationship between medicine and music in your journey? 

[00:05:18] Elijah: Yeah, medicine and music, The first thing that comes to mind is that music is medicine in itself, and some incredible facilitators that I've come to know. one is named Adrian. One is named Calvin.

I've been able to sit in their circles and also witness. What music can do without needing an external, substance that gets ingested. But simply what the power of circling and circling in the context of song and circling in the context of music, what that can do for one's being in one's body.

Because music is medicine. Cuz sound is medicine, [00:06:00] right? Like you play these. Notes and these chords on this guitar. Really what the guitar's doing, it's just emitting different frequencies. And there are 12 musical notes. And the reason why th those notes persisted over time is because they have a specific coherent frequency, right?

If you play one of those notes, you, anyone would probably say, oh, that sounds good. You play an off note. Someone's gonna tell you that sounds bad because they, you can feel it in your field. You can feel it in your vibratory field. Whether this is a coherent or incoherent frequency. And so thinking of music as medicine, you can think of the frequencies that are emitting from this guitar and those frequencies traveling through space, interacting with your field, balancing your field.

And also the act of singing and using your voice, which again [00:07:00] is the vibration of your vocal chords. the loosening of these muscles, the opening of your voice, the opening of your channels. So the first thing that comes up for me is that music itself is medicine, but then when you ask about the relationship between plant medicine and the music,they're very close, friends.

I would say it's hard for me to, it's hard for me to imagine one without the other. I've sat with a lot of plant medicine in silence, and even in the silence, I'm hearing music all the time. It seems like even if no one's there playing music, The music still comes to me through the medicine, and that comes through in the form of different melodies being received through the medicine that comes through for me actually hearing different instruments and I'm like, yo, is somebody playing an instrument right now?

[00:08:00] And it's no, it's just the plant, what the plant medicine's bringing to me. And then there's this very real symphony of nature. That is happening at any given moment. And when you think of the core building blocks of music, you have harmony, you have melody, and you have rhythm, right?

And all of these, all three of these can be found. Anywhere in this jungle, right? You go and stand anywhere, you're gonna be able to feel and hear rhythm, harmony, and melody. And so even if I'm not in a circle where someone is playing music and sitting in silence with plant medicine, the music's still there.

It seems like the music and the plant medicine go very hand in hand. 

[00:08:47] Nick: Yeah, this really resonates with my experience as the plant medicine as well. I'm not sure if you've experienced this in your journey, but I had a very distinct experience about a year ago where after taking [00:09:00] Ayahuasca, the morning after I was laying in bed fresh off the plant medicine and I started to hear, songs in instruments and repetition of words in my head.

Where it was almost like there was a sono speaker right behind my head playing a full blast. And whenever, wherever I put my attention inside of the room, the melody, the harmony, the voices and the Repetition awards would change. And this was the case for about a day and a half. So I went and spoke to the shaman and told him I was doing this and he, he mentioned that I was hearing Iki Rose and ICAR Rose is the sound of.

The resident frequencies of everything that is around us. Everything has aro. Whether it's the chair sitting in the corner of the room, your heart, at any given moment, the bubble will be flying next to the flower. Everything has a song that's explicitly spoke, that's spoken at any given time, and through the medicine and through other means.

We actually can tap in and listen to those songs. 

[00:09:59] Elijah: [00:10:00] Aho. Yeah,that's my experience as well. And sometimes I'll receive these ecos I'll say the these, so these resonant frequencies of the nature beings. And then other times I'll receive like English songs. Like I'll just receive songs and melodies that come to me.

and then other times I'll be channeling Some other languages, whatever they may be, and they come out very rhythmically and come out almost like a mantra. And maybe they're ecos, but I feel like sometimes I'm channeling some stuff and my mouth is moving in all these weird ways that it would never move.

In my normal day to day, and I'm like, yo, I didn't even know my mouth could make those kind of movements. 

[00:10:47] Nick: Yeah. I feel you. I've, not to just just to reflect back, I don't think it's a coincidence that our company's called Modern Mantra. It's I've, when I'm doing energy work with people, it's like mantras just come through [00:11:00] and it's no longer a place of judgment.

Of saying okay, this is okay, this is not okay. Or even thought, I just let 'em come through as they normally would. And,if I'm in the presence of somebody, I just let them know Hey, just so you know, I might be in mantra. It's all good, where, I think it's, I think what I find fascinating about the position you're in is that these practices in tapping into these energies, into these sounds, has become so normal in your day-to-day.

And you've also shared with me that y there's a, process of waking up, many mornings of the week next to river, having a spoonful of the medicine and starting your days in that way and,from one entrepreneur or to the other, what has this shown you about the way that we flow in our lives and what challenges have it brought?

Has it brought up to you as an entrepreneur? Yeah, it's a 

[00:11:50] Elijah: great question. So the spoon protocol is what it's referred to, and we were waking up at dusk where Dawn [00:12:00] actually dawn and heading down to the river, and we would receive a spoon of the plant medicine of the ayahuasca and. what that spoon protocol has taught me?

A few. A few things. One is just it. It continues to reinforce and reiterate the importance of morning practice, right? The importance of Sada in one's life and the role that Sada plays in one's attunement. In their life, right? We as instruments, how are we keeping ourself in tune? Just that guitar has those resonant and coherent frequencies, we as well are instruments, vessels, channels that are played.

And so it continued to emphasize the importance of that morning practice. Now you add on the layer. Of the plant medicine, which is atypical to my [00:13:00] normal morning practice, and I found that the,it would bring information from me, like the medicine would bring new information from me.

And the first day that we did the spoon protocol, I didn't bring a notebook. Every other day after that, I brought a notebook. Simply because the first day I was like, oh, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna be in meditation by the river, hanging out. And then I'm like, oh, I'm receiving a lot of information right now that I wanna capture, so I'm gonna bring my notebook.

So as an entrepreneur, that was, that was definitely something to note that the me that we can work with these medicines very intentionally and. These medicines have great wisdom to, to teach us, and I also recognize that it's always going to be personal. Everyone's interaction with the medicine is going to be entirely different based on our disposition, based on our makeup, based on the metaphors we use.[00:14:00] 

And yeah,it brought clarity and information in terms of, Where to draw inspiration from. And a lot of it, it taught me a lot about the technology within nature and the music within nature and the design of nature. So really this, you know, getting new found inspiration from the natural world and then also gave me insight into creation.

into what it is that I'm being asked to create and weave together. What's the tapestry that I'm being asked to weave and that we are being asked to weave. so those are some of the things that came up. 

[00:14:45] Nick: Yeah. I'd love to double click on, what new information you found around what's being asked to be weaved together?

[00:14:51] Elijah: Yeah. So when you think about technology, most people are going, their minds are gonna go to the phones in their hand, the computers in [00:15:00] front of them, the microphone that I'm speaking into, which, yes, that is technology, but technology is much more vast than that. at the root. At the root, I really think the simplest definition.

Of technology is like the practical application of knowledge or wisdom, and if you think of technology as the practical application of knowledge or wisdom, you can then begin to see that there are different, entirely different categories of technology. So we have what I would call endogenous technology, endogenous meaning it's inside of us.

We don't have to look outside of us. Everything is here endogenous. And then there's exogenous technology, which is the technology external to us. And when you think of even those, even that distinction, just to paint the picture, you can think [00:16:00] of an exogenous technology as artificial intelligence, right As chat G P T, right?

Let's say chat. G P T is an exogenous technology that we can use for different purposes. Now, pranayama is also technology. Now Pranayama is breath work. From the Veic tradition, pr being the life force that the breath carries, the breath is the carrier of this prana life force, Yama meaning technique, and the, this prana, yama, these breath techniques, these breath technologies go thousands of years back to the Vedas.

And really you can look at the breath as an interface. Just like I'm looking at this computer and this is a user interface. The breath can actually be utilized as it, it is an interface as well. [00:17:00] And we can work with the breath as a controller, right? if I'm sitting here on the computer and my keyboard is a controller, Within my body, my breath is a controller.

I can use my breath to entirely control my state of consciousness and my state of mind. I can use my breath to access information. I can use my breath to open up my voice. And so when you ask about these creations, it's really the essence of it is really the tapestry between the endogenous and the exogenous, the tapestry.

Between how we attune ourselves using our own medicine, our own endogenous technology, and how we use that attuned, expanded, awakened state to cope, to create and manifest using the exogenous technologies. So you can look at it as the weaving of endogenous and [00:18:00] exogenous. You can look at it as the weaving between ancient and modern.

But really there's, there, that's the essence of a lot of what I was, tapping into during these spoon protocol sessions specifically is just what is that we, what's the weaving of that tapestry? 

[00:18:22] Nick: And do you feel that endogenous technology is technology that is quote unquote, naturally occurring? Is that where we draw the line versus exogenous, which is, takes some level of.

innovation and effort and mixing of what is not naturally occurring, or how do you draw those lines? 

[00:18:38] Elijah: Yeah, so the way I'm seeing endogenous technology, it's not about the, it's not about the naturally occurring aspect per se, cuz I would say yes at a base level, just breathing to stay alive. that's a natural, that's a [00:19:00] ju just a normal everyday function of this human operating system, which on some level, yes, one can look at that and think that, that is some level or layer of technology.

But really what I'm referring to is the intentional usage of the breath. The conscious usage of the breath. So most people go their entire lives and never take a conscious breath, right? Most people go their entire lives and never actually think about the breath and think about the ways that they can utilize it.

And so the pranayama is not just. Us breathing in our normal state. The pranayama are intentional ways of utilizing the breath as a controller to open our channels, to expand our consciousness and to come into presence. so it's really that practical application. That intentional application.[00:20:00] the naturally occurring breath is the raw material.

and really you're taking this raw material of the breath and bringing this in the technique to it, the technology to it, the interaction, the intention to it. 

[00:20:16] Nick: Yeah. I love what you said about the breath is your life controller. Like a lot of people don't realize that simply by breathing in quickly.

Your inhales are longer than your exhales can give you energy, and by breathing out longer than you breathe in, you can actually decrease your heart rate. So breathe in longer, your heart rate increases. Breathe out longer. Your heart rate decreases. So you have this embedded controller or this dial within us that can get us moving quicker and put us into a heightened state, and that can ma make us move slower and put us into a more relaxed state.

It's always available to you, but you're right, not many people even know [00:21:00] that trick to begin with. 

[00:21:03] Elijah: Yes. and these, like what you're naming is a very clear example of how the breath can be a controller. And even thinking about this in the context of innovation, right? In the context of creation, in the context of myself as a digital creator.

So my hypothesis is that if someone sat down, let's say you're a writer, right? And you're a copywriter. And you sit down and you're writing some sort of an article, right? Maybe the normal way is to sit down and just start writing whatever your process may be. But there's another way. what if one incorporated some pranayama could be before the writing could also be during a writing break.

I will. I will go off to say that I will guarantee that the output will be different. Because what the breath can do, the breath can expand our [00:22:00] consciousness, awaken different inf, awaken different pieces of information, allow different neurons to fire, bring us into presence, bring us into tuning in to exactly what it is that I'm here to write, almost to the point.

And you can get to the point where the words may almost appear themselves on the screen depending on what attunement practices you utilize. 

[00:22:25] Nick: it feels like what you really need to is the exogenous technology is more effective when the endogenous technology is tuned first. 

[00:22:34] Elijah: Precisely.

Precisely. And I think really what it comes down to is this notion of dharmic design. Let's call it dharma, right? And every dharma is another veic. Concept of veic, knowing veic wisdom, that really speaks to the governing law of all of [00:23:00] nature, right? That the tree has a specific dharma and the tree cannot be anything but the tree.

It can't actually act outside of the model of a tree. And it's believed that we as individuals all have our own individual dharma. our own individual, purpose and our own individual core disposition, our center. And so these techniques, these endogenous technologies, I really see them as tools to be able to access our center.

And I think that the act of creation looks very different. When you are creating from your core, when you're creating from your center. So the endogenous technologies are the gateway to tune into the center. And then the exogenous technologies are the tools that we utilize to, to manifest our visions [00:24:00] into reality.

I 

[00:24:02] Nick: love the oscillation. That you're painting between, going inward, finding your center, making sure the guitar is tuned in order to set up so you can play the right notes. it's like you can play the most beautiful song in the world, but if the guitar's not in tune, it's gonna sound a little bit off.

[00:24:21] Elijah: That's totally right. And I think the guitar's a, it's a great analogy. because the guitar has six strings, right? if you believe in chakra science, right? We have these different energy centers in our bodies. So these energy centers in our bodies, based on the most popular.

Diagrams or formats of the charka system. One may believe that we have seven charkas, right? I believe there are more energy centers. There are more energy centers and channels that run all through our body. But let's say there are seven core energy centers and there are six strings on [00:25:00] the typical guitar.

And just like a guitar is a musical instrument that we would tune, right? We're tuning it because it's going to not only allow each string to sound coherent on its own, but it's going to allow for harmony between all of the different notes. And it's the same. It's the same with us, except instead of looking at us as a musical instrument, you can look at us as a creative.

Instrument, right? and looking at these energy centers and our energy anatomy as what we're tuning so that we can find those coherent frequencies so that we can find that harmony, so that we can find that center. And you've also 

[00:25:47] Nick: been through this program, learning the guitar. I've witnessed you to Guitar Skills 1000 x since the last time I've seen you.

What have you learned from going so deep with this instrument, and what [00:26:00] other information do you have to share around that? 

[00:26:03] Elijah: Thanks for the question. I have been perpetually blown away by the human discovery of music through the guitar. Just thinking like,these objects, these everyday objects are so easy to take for granted, right?

It's just like you pick up a guitar and it's, yeah, it's a guitar. It's there, but it, always blows my mind to think of the human discovery of these instruments and really, like the drum, for example, the Jim Bay. I really see that as the heartbeat of the earth. if earth is a living being, the drum is that heartbeat.

It's that rhythm, And so I believe that humans created the drum based on nature. I believe music is derived from nature. All of these instruments are derived from nature. and now with the guitar, wow, the [00:27:00] guitar is way different than, The drum in a lot of ways, one of the most profound ways is that it's an entire mathematical system, the guitar, and I'm just, it is one of those things where it's like, how did we figure this out?

And some people may believe that it's trial and error. Others like myself may believe that it's received, like this was downloaded. This was information that was received by these higher level functions, these other entities, these other beings that also occupy this life with us. And so the guitar, what it's taught me is how to use my voice, how to con, how to control my voice.

Because I now have this instrument where I'm, where the,it's creating the rhythm and the harmony, and I'm layering on the melody [00:28:00] and really finding the symbiosis, finding the flow of how is my frequency in resonance with what I'm playing in the guitar. and so it really teaches this great wisdom of tuning in.

To tuning into others, tuning into the energy of others, tuning into the energy of nature, because really it's an act of tuning into the guitar. I need to tune myself to the sound of the guitar, and how do we, me and the guitar, find the harmony between the voice and the strengths. And secondly, it's just been a, the greatest gift that I could give myself.

Is to be able to create music. And sure, anybody can create music by sitting down and maybe banging on the floor and using their voice or beatboxing, endogenous instruments. but the guitar has really been such [00:29:00] a great gift in being able to incorporate sound, sound more expansively and extensively into my own practice, like having a personal music practice.

has changed me, has evolved me, has expanded me, and has brought me to new heights of using my voice and,feeling centered and feeling in flow. So yeah, those are some of the things that come up for me. 

[00:29:27] Nick: One thing that, I witnessed when I visited you guys now in Costa Rica was also how far your partner Cam has come along on her own musical journey.

In witnessing her and how incredible she is and how far she's come along and witnessing you to creating music together, do you feel like the music has given you a deeper sense of intimacy between you two? 

[00:29:50] Elijah: Oh, def definitely. Yeah. Because now when we talk about harmonizing with the voice and the guitar, now, it's also like, okay, now when me and Cam sing together, [00:30:00] it's an act of me and my partner harmonizing our voices.

And now we both play the guitar so we can harmonize with the guitars. she'll be playing something and I can play something complimentary and we're both singing. So it's yet another way for us to connect. It's yet another way for us to connect and find more depth in our relationship.

And we have, we're planning to, start busking when we get back to Asheville. You know, we're thinking, yeah. We're thinking, yo, we're just jamming in the house. Let's just go out in public and jam in public and just, create these little pop-up experiences with us. Just busking, bringing out a speaker and also wanting to weave.

The digital and the analog. So I wanna get a looper. I want Cam has a mixer and I wanna actually bring digital soundscapes together with the organic soundscapes. Kind of [00:31:00] like a bit of a modern mantra, you know, a bit of like an ancient future, a little like digital analog combo. 

[00:31:07] Nick: Maybe I can bring, my projector.

We can make some visuals simultaneously too. you can do a lot of cool stuff with light when it comes to music integration. 

[00:31:16] Elijah: That's what I was thinking. Now, I was thinking next time the three of us are together, I just haven't either some intentionally planned experiences or some pop-up experiences, or maybe we just choose like a location in Lisbon.

And just start and then just find a nice wall that you can project on. Funny, 

[00:31:38] Nick: funny enough, one of my buddies, he did, the projection mapping of Gaudi's Castle and, a couple of his buildings in Spain, and man, like 10,000 people came out one night to see this incredible projection mapping. And I messaged our team have, you've got this,this incredible group of people here called MU Labs, the best digital artists and [00:32:00] projection.

Artists in Portugal around bending light. And we have been looking for a wall, you know, some ancient architecture to projection map. And I don't think it's very farfetched for us to just set it up for one night. we also have this meetup group, this Elizabeth New Tech meetup with about 900 people in it.

We can just launch it and have a party. I think like the barrier to entry to having, going from like zero to. Musical and lights and playful magnificence is very low with everything that we've set up in our PR respective communities. 

[00:32:35] Elijah: Yes, and I would love to even think about it. It what?

What does that look like and feel like to bring a new tech meetup into a music, a sound and light experience, right? Because I know you're somebody who. When you're dancing, when you're moving, you're receiving a lot of information. like you're, that's when some of that's when like big [00:33:00] downloads come through for you.

you'll be at festivals and then you'll just send me like these crazy downloads that you received while dancing. And so I'm just saying that's some insight as to what happens when you put these innovators, these creators into these attunement experiences using light, using sound.

And I'm curious to know what, sorry? Did you have a response to that? Well, 

[00:33:24] Nick: if you're looking at through the lens of endogenous and exogenous technology and the intention is to balance the use of both, right? Then the new tech meetup really works with both, right? And actually, funny enough, I have hosted some.

Not explicitly technology focused events before one of 'em was our friend Moe, giving a whole talk about some Pedro and Ayahuasca and the influence and history of these medicines. I don't feel like it's farfetched at all to have something that combines the be of best of the endogenous and the exogenous hosted in Lisbon with what we already have on hand, 

[00:33:57] Elijah: Aho.

So one question I had for [00:34:00] you to elaborate on is around bending light. You mentioned that mu labs are some of the best light benders in Portugal. So what are you referring to when you talk about bending light? So our buddy 

[00:34:12] Nick: Chico, he created a project called, the Voxel Cube.

And the intention behind it is to, visualize the, human brain. So it's basically like a, piece of art that you stand in the middle of. You put an EKG sensor on your head, which has a realtime input of your brainwaves into a computer, alongside a realtime input of your body's point. Cloud. A point Cloud is basically a, digital outline of your body in the physical space.

We put that through a computer. And the computer takes it and outputs that using art, using videos through a projector all around you. So from my perspective, when I first witnessed the, so the art piece, and actually you were there, you performed inside the voxel [00:35:00] cube, to me it felt like the visualization of the human aura.

we are effectively taking, your spaceship, your space in the physical space and your mind and mental brainwaves, and then outputting that in a colorful mosaic around the individual to encompass them. a lot of spiritual teaching points to the belief of the fact that we have auras, right?

We already know that birds and they see in a different dimension of light. They see in the dimension of all these different spectrums of color and of information that emulate off of us, and we basically took this software. And we mapped it, took a step further and mapped the brainwaves to the Russell wheels of emotion.

So now we have software in place that depending on if you're feeling happy, if you're feeling sad, if you're feeling activated, if you're feeling low, we can serve up auto automatically. Different projections, different videos that will [00:36:00] demonstrate your mood using video software in real time according to how you are feeling inside of that moment.

So that's a high level overview of what Chico's done. And then on my own, path, I basically ended up with a,very high power projector that I've been going around Portugal to different parties, to different events, to different festivals. Doing projection mapping shows. So I've got about 20 hours of content now, some of it AI produced, handmade, A lot of it collected from around the internet from different visual artists that I can bend together into different layers to create a.

A show of light and the intention is to gauge the energetic composition of a room and to match that to visuals. So I have basically accumulated a bunch of software and content and, I get invited to a lot of cool places, to do that, which I'm super, super excited about. The pay is shit. It's not really made from making money.

[00:37:00] frankly, being up till three in the morning at a party isn't really in resonance with my life's mission at this point in time. But, Man, do I enjoy the artistic output of this? I think 

[00:37:10] Elijah: we should weave it all together into modern mantra experiences and like actually have these components coming together.

Because even now, like 10 years ago, if we were talking about this, people would say, yo, they're talking about two very different things right now. We talk about this. People may still think that, ah, they're these things are like different. You're talking about The breath and energy, and you're also talking about technology and cubes and augmented reality.

And I think that the gap, the perceived gap, we already know that there's a lot of overlap here, but I think there's a. There's more of this overlap to be explored on the forefront because what you're naming with new labs, which I witnessed, it's incredible, right?

So you're standing [00:38:00] in a cube and one's brain waves are determining the visuals of the cube. another example is when we met Theon, the founder of Synesthesia at Envision Festival. He showed us his glasses where we were able to see the infrared map of the space. And so when you think about where that's all heading, I think that there's going to be an incredible synthesis between our internal states and what we can utilize the external technologies for.

For example, when you think about. Augmented reality, being able to pick up on infrared, being able to pick up on, on heat,and with this understanding that we're not just these human bodies, we're actually humans that are inside of an egg, like we're essentially inside of an energy egg, which to [00:39:00] most people, those energy eggs are invisible, but physically they're very real.

like anyone that has done any smidgen of reiki or of hand healing knows that our energy fields are very real. That's why maybe you're standing in the presence of someone and you're feeling something. You don't know what you're feeling. But yeah, because even if you're standing some next to someone and not touching them physically, you can still touch them with your energy orb.

And so I think when the external, the exogenous technology allows us to make the invisible visible, I think there's a lot more that we're gonna be tapping into. And one vision that came up for me is like a, like an augmented reality, maybe a mixed reality application for reiki healers, you know, being able to actually see a map.

Right to visualize the map. Cuz some people see the map already, some [00:40:00] healers don't. They might feel it more, they might, but just thinking of the application of a mixed reality software that can allow people to visualize and see the energy map, the energy anatomy of a human being. 

[00:40:14] Nick: When you talk about the interface for energy workers, I've been practicing energy work for several years now, and to me it's a very visceral experience. So when I'm in these containers with these individuals, what I'm experiencing is a stream of visuals, visual metaphors that are coming in real time and these.

Metaphors of these spirits, whatever you wanna label them as are performing work onto the participant that I am sitting with. And you know the, it's fascinating because I'm in this position where I can act as the observer is the space holder and the person witnessing these profound [00:41:00] dynamics between spirits.

And between somebody's field, but there's no way for me to communicate that visually to the people that sit with me today. And I'm not even saying this is legitimately happening. What I'm saying is that there are certain metaphors that my mind is accustomed to, that when this energy work is taking place are being shown to me to explain at some level what is going through this individual that I am sitting with.

The, and when it comes to healing work and really any healing work in general, there is a user interface that is at play. There are higher dimensional beings that are being called into a given space. We've witnessed this in many shaman circles, right? Some of it being shared between people, others being witnessed by others in very unique ways, which have not been mapped from the endogenous into the exogynous.

And I believe that's what you're pointing to. There is a gap between what is [00:42:00] happening in these higher realms and the technology that is available to us through these natural means and what our silicon is currently capable of doing. I believe that there's going to be a very rapid expansion of AI's capabilities.

That has some mix of flavor with something around what Chico is making with this cube that is going to empower, these healers to, demonstrate what it is they're witnessing. There's one project specifically that came out where they now have the ability to put a sensor on top of somebody's head and then visualize the video output of someone's brain in real time.

So there's a side by side comparison of a person wearing this headset watching a movie, and what the software is outputting in real time. What does that mean? There's going to be a [00:43:00] direct correlation between what I'm seeing inside of my head. And what is recorded in play backable to the individuals in the room.

So this brain to, or you call spirit to video interface already exists. Now when that video can be connected a step further into augmented reality, so that there's a direct correlation between the healer and the outputted projection, around an individual, I believe that's going to, when that interface hits the world, it's going to change everything.

For the first time, you're going to be able to witness the perspective of healers. You're gonna be able to witness the perspective of individuals. you might see a distress individual and witness the depth of their suffering that is happening around you. you might also witness the. For example, the carbon output that's happening in the world around you, right?

All these little smoky spirits that are coming on the back of our cars, of these burning fossils that are currently invisible to us, that are suddenly going to [00:44:00] be visible. And it will be a translation between what is happening in the physical world into the digital in real time, and or what is happening in my own mental or spiritual world, and happening in real time.

And I believe this is, this has the fundamental ability to change the world. And AI is going to get us to a point where I believe this will be accomplished within the next, depending on how AI happens, conservatively the next decade, possibly with AI inventing itself and iterating upon itself possibly with as soon as the next five years.

[00:44:33] Elijah: This is a shift I'm very excited for and I see it happening. A few things come up for me based on your share. One is the public perception shift that happens when a client or a patient is able to see their own energy field in what is actually happening to it. Because there's a lot of people in the world that think, oh, [00:45:00] reiki, that's some hippie, that's some hippie dippy bullshit.

You and I know that it's very real. And once you're taking something that to a lot of people is unreal and you're making it real because we rely so much on our eyes. Like as human beings, we depend so much on our eyes that it's not real till I can see it. and so with this energy field from the patient or client perspective and just using this energy healing as an example, To speak to a broader shift, but once I am able to actually visualize that, I also think it's largely in line with this trend of.

Science, quote unquote science, catching up to ancestral wisdom, right? These things that these ancestors had the wisdom, had the knowledge, had the technology that they were using, and the public doesn't really believe it, doesn't believe meditation [00:46:00] works, doesn't believe all these things. And then all the scientific studies come out and people are like, oh, meditation and mindfulness is great.

And I feel like that's gonna happen a lot more. A once people are able to visualize energy, two, once, once people are able to visualize channeled information, because you're talking about the remo, you're talking about the instantaneous manifesta, the instantaneous visual manifestation of thoughts. Is what you're talking about with that movie program and that same technology can be utilized, whether it's my thoughts or whether it's channeled information.

and what happens when someone like a really talented, really gifted, really tapped in a kasik record reader, is able to plug into, to said technology and visualize what they are receiving. And I think these are fundamentally gonna change the way that we live. And I [00:47:00] see the emerging user interfaces and artificial intelligence.

Being the core pillars of driving that shift, right? The com, the convergence of these two technological paradigm shifts, right? One is that user interfaces are going to evolve beyond this two-dimensional screen that you and I are looking at, and Earth is going to become a designable interface. I think virtual reality's still gonna stay and it'll have its specific use cases, but I really think the bigger shift is going to come in augmented and mixed reality when we actually have Planet Earth as a designable visual graphic interface that we can interface with, and then artificial intelligence and everything happening there.

What we're seeing now is really a stop. On the train to get to this future of [00:48:00] instantaneous manifestation, right? So now when we have Earth as a user interface and instantaneous manifestation stuff's going to change significantly. Yeah, it, 

[00:48:13] Nick: and it's happening faster than I ever thought possible to be perfectly frank.

AI is, make it so you can manifest an image, faster than ever before. There used to be one, maybe a hundred thousand great graphic designers. With the rise of Dolly in image generation interfaces, there's now billions of great graphic designers. And also if you're looking at today, maybe there's 20,000 great energy workers on the planet.

With the rise of ai, I believe there's going to be billions of great energy workers on the planet, or a super intelligence that helps heal all of us at a very accelerated rate. one thing I did want to touch on in the grand scheme of things is the, is it real comment? And when I think about these things and I feel into these things, even when these interfaces emerge, [00:49:00] even when you know you, you're able to visualize spirits or visualize what the practitioners see in real time.

A lot of people are just going to label that as imagination. A lot of people are just going to label that Is non-real and that is their right. So what I tell people and what I tell other healers, in their practices is the impact of the work is only as effective as the trust that the participant has in the practitioner.

We can only move at the speed of trust. So in the event that the participant does not have trust in the practitioner, The medicine or whatever movement or whatever energy work is being applied is going to be ineffective. And normally what ends up happening, in these situations that have been in these small handful of times, is the participant walks out there feeling like they just got hit by a train.

there was a lot of resistance. Their body doesn't feel good. They feel that,[00:50:00] there, there is a fight. imagine laying down for an hour and fighting energies that are running through you. This is why when I perform these energy work sessions as a group, I actually invite participants to leave before the work starts.

I say very explicitly, if you do not have trust in myself or in the other co-facilitators, that are leading this session, I ask that you leave now. Otherwise, we are on this airplane together, we will take off and we will land together. We are your pilots, we are your steward. It says, if you need anything, raise your hand and.

I do feel badly for those who don't believe in magic, the ones who don't believe that we have this incredible help of these spirits, of these energies of ourselves to really do some of the most profound healing work in our lives. And they're always going to be these people. Even with these interfaces, even with these metaphors, even with the expansion of being able to visualize the earth as an interface, you're still going to have climate change deniers.

You're still gonna have people that don't [00:51:00] want to pick up the medicine of healing, and that is perfectly okay. but the hope is by bringing these things, the in endogenous, into the exogenous, through this augmented reality technology, we have an opportunity to heal a much larger portion of the planet, an accelerated rate.

[00:51:18] Elijah: And that's what we're here to do. So that's what we're here to help usher in, right? is how we can. Empower people to be, to be in their center. To create from their center. and what you're saying is not everyone is going to have this type of faith, cuz I think, you use the word trust.

I also think there's this notion of faith, right? this believing and this trusting, this having faith. And that's totally okay. It's totally valid. Everyone has their own perception and. Yet we are here to support those who are walking their spiritual path, who do believe that there's some higher level [00:52:00] function.

that there's more than the I can see. And I think that by doing that, by empowering these creators, these digital creators that are walking this path of expanding their consciousness, that is the gateway to spreading this medicine to. To more people. So 

[00:52:21] Nick: yeah, I feel like we could continue talking about this stuff for a long time and we will, but yeah.

I've got to go give a talk in about an hour, to a group of entrepreneurs who are, I don't know their level of spiritual path, this, but hopefully get them thinking the same way we are. So unfortunately, I think we do have to end it. yeah, I think 

[00:52:43] Elijah: this was a good organic stopping point. Kind of felt like the right time.

Yeah. 

[00:52:49] Nick: and now we can transition to talk about more about this privately and what this actually means logistically. Yeah. 

[00:52:55] Elijah: Thank you all. Have a good day. Thanks everyone. Peace.

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